• Visit Rob at Thoughtbubble

• The Mountains of Madness by Adam Fyda

• Disco Elysium on Steam

• Riddley Walker by Russell Hoban

• Bosworth Toller Anglo-Saxon dictionary

• The Putney dive-bombing incident

• WOTW - An archive of video game maps and the Antarctic life of an IT guy Brr

• DJI Mini Pro goes portrait (don't ask)

• Letters of Note – Steve Albini

• Twitter NFT bombed

• Twitter bid from Elon Musk

• Alan Moore on BBC Maestro

• OpenAI

• Proxima Sera released

• Nicholas font

• Elements of Typographic Style

With just under a month until Christmas and a Tory junta, join North V South in a societal meltdown as we dance naked through the streets, waving our willies at our clients as we go.

• North V South

• Hoeffler V Hasselhoff

• Nukes V Rebukes

• Rusty Brown V Ochre

• Chris Ware V Designers with no underwear

• Staples V Meeples

• Pie V Pie

We ask the questions that the Conservative and Labour parties are too afraid to ask:

• How are your biorhythms this morning?

• Will there be baby woodpeckers in Rob's garden this winter?

• What is a brand guru and is it strictly legal?

• And, finally, what kind of casserole would Darth Vader eat?

We talk Wim Crouwel, Somerset House, Nokia, rival podcasts, paper aeroplanes, Lego adverts, ketchup and the imminent end of civilisation.

Links:

• Provenance by Ann Leckie — Rob's reading the latest Ann Leckie slice of sci-fi. And very good it is too.
• Alamein to Zem Zem - Faber & Faber — Jon's latest read. The only book of poems from WWII comparable to those of the Great War by Owen, Sassoon, or Graves.
• Netflix - Abstract — Netflix's excellent art and design documentary series is back for season 2. We've both enjoyed the episode on Jonathon Hoefler.
• Inktober — Mr Jake Parker — Inktober. Get your pens ready for a month of drawing.
• Membership Options - Somerset House — Somerset house has announced details of its membership options. Surprisingly affordable.
• Design Manchester – Manchester’s seventh design festival, from 11–22 October 2017 — Designer Manchester, running from 11th – 24th November.
• A profile of Wim Crouwel: the Dutch graphic designer - YouTube — A profile of legendary designer Wim Crouwel who died recently.
• Why Every CEO Needs to Think Like a Hacker, Stalker, or White Nationalist — Good article on why creators of (mainly) digital products and platforms need to consider how they can be used for bad, as well as good.
• The Rissington Podcast: Episode 21 - Housekeeping & warming up after a 10 year break — Back after ten years away.
• Nokia 2720 Flip - Nokia phones - United Kingdom - English — Nokia producing a lovely looking little flip phone.
• Xiaomi’s Mi Mix Alpha is almost entirely made of screen - The Verge — Xiaomi produces a ludicrously sci-fi looking smartphone. Check out the light show as it charges.
• Daniel Benneworth-Gray on Twitter: "Fascinating thread on the deeply personal ways in which we visualise time. https://t.co/z6EiIgpx1I" / Twitter — Incredible.
• POWERUP 4.0 - Smartphone Controlled Paper Airplane by Shai Goitein — Kickstarter — It wouldn't be an episode of NvS without a Kickstarter. This one looks great.
• Lego reveals first brand campaign in 30 years, Rebuild the World - It's Nice That — Curious new brand campaign from Lego.
• Heinz Pour Perfectly - Rethink Canada — We're both in agreement. This is a bit ridiculous.
• New Studies Warn of Cataclysmic Solar Superstorms - Scientific American — Rob's prediction for the likeliest doomsday scenario. Cheerful stuff.
• Photographer Philip Butler traces the surviving iconic Odeon cinemas of the 1930s - Creative Boom — Rob's website/article/book of the week. Philip Butler's wonderful photographs of 1920's and 30's Odeon cinemas.
• Flexible, resilient and nimble - Supple Studio — Jon's website of the week. Supple studio. Great looking and effective site, for a small studio, producing lovely design, that seems like a great place to work.

Our Deeply Unintelligent™ AI units have digested the internet and spend an hour talking about a whole load of utter nonsense: Camping, depression, 3D resin printers, Blender, Bocage, Lemmie, Mindhunter, Creative constipation, Inktober, District 9, Alan Moore, Vanta black cars, Boots, John Harris, Dieter Rams, London Design Festival. And pies.

In this episode we look at a new Akira, online criticism, linocuts, LEGO Space, single line typefaces, meander maps and Apollo XI in realtime.

Links:

• The Etherington Brothers — Rob got the latest offering from the Etherington Bros - an absolute must for anyone, young or old, in to drawing.
• Heather Antos on Twitter: "PRO TIP…" — Sage advice from Heather.
• All 7 new LEGO City Space sets for summer 2019 are now available [News] -The Brothers Brick -The Brothers Brick — It''s Space Jon, but not as we know it.
• The Marvelous Mississippi River Meander Maps — Map madness.
• BBC World Service - 13 Minutes to the Moon — Relive the Apollo 11 moon mission.
• Astronomy Photographer of the Year 2019 shortlist – in pictures - Science - The Guardian — My God, it''s full of stars.
• Giorgio Morandi - Wikipedia — Jon has discovered a new artist…
• Counter-Print Book Set — Jon''s reading list for the next… eight years.
• ColorLibrary - The Unique Furnace in Venice - Orsoni Venezia 1888 — Class glass.
• National Park Typeface — Gorgeous typeface, and website. Yogi Bear would be proud.
• Cutting Edge: Modernist British Printmaking -Dulwich Picture Gallery — An exhibition of 1930s British printmaking over at The Dulwich Picture Gallery.
• The Stack: Every Layout — Jon was very excited about this resource for website design / coding. Rob, not so much.
• Apollo 11 in Real-time — More Apollo 11 goodness (well the anniversary is coming up). Relive the entire Apollo 11 mission in real time.

This week we talk about, in no particular order: model robots, LEGO Space, Worzel Gummidge, notebooks, touch typing, Mac Pro, sweet wrappers, knots, the evils of social media, and, biensûr, pies.

Links:

• Digital Agency London - TOKYO - Fyre Festival — Tokyo Agency are brave enough to show their work for the ill-fated Fyre Festival.
• NASA Apollo 11 Lunar Lander - 10266 - Creator Expert - LEGO Shop — Celebrating the Apollo 11 moon landing, Lego has a new Creator Expert set available.
• Apollo 11 Command Module — See inside the Apollo 11 command module.
• Britannia (TV series) - Wikipedia — Jon's been watching Britannia.
• Why Ignoring Your Children Will Make Everyone Happier by Tom Hodgkinson - Hachette UK — Jon's been listening to this.
• The new Mac Pro is Apple’s love letter to forgotten die-hard Mac fans - Macworld — The new Apple Mac Pro
• Totebook – Studio Neat — We love this notebook. Also check out the pano version.
• Wrappers Delight by Jonny Trunk — Kickstarter — A new book celebrating nostalgic sweet wrappers.
• Animated Knots by Grog - Learn how to tie knots with step-by-step animation — Just wonderful!
• Can “Indie” Social Media Save Us? - The New Yorker — Great article on some of the options available if you want social media - but don't want to play with the big boys.

In other news: Panic's Playdate, BT's new look, Manga at the British something or other, Microsoft browsers, Shanghai bookshops, and, naturellement, pies.

Links:

• Playdate. A New Handheld Gaming System — Software house Panic have branched out in to Hardware with a cute little hand-held games console.
• IM Pei: celebrated architect behind Louvre pyramid dead at 102 - Art and design - The Guardian
• Mirrored Ceilings and Criss-Crossed Stairwells Give a Chinese Bookstore the Feeling of an M.C. Escher Woodcut - Colossal — A stunning bookstore in China.
• X+Living — Architects of the bookstore above.
• "Street Corner at Worlds End, London, 1954. — A wonderful photo that cropped up in Rob's Twitter feed, by Inge Morath.
• Love is the Devil — Jon's been watching Love and the Devil and digging deeper in to the life of painter Francis Bacon.
• Francis Bacon: Anatomy of an Enigma: Amazon.co.uk: Michael Peppiatt: 8601417755228: Books — Bacon reading.
• Microsoft Edge Insider — Microsoft is back with a new browser for the Mac.
• BT unveils new logo after years of work – its name in a circle - Business - The Guardian — BT rebrand. The usual pile-on via social media.
• Manga at the British Museum exhibition review — Manga comes to the British Museum.
• Fighting Fantasy Fest 3 - fightingfantasy — Who knew there was a convention for Fighting Fantasy books? Not us.
• Airline Logos — Wonderful collection of mid-century US airline logos from Reagan Ray.
• South Coast Journal — How to do a local magazine the right way.
• Fantasma - Magic Rock Brewing — Gluten Free IPA from Magic Rock.
• A new Guy Warley print over at Ellipress — Cockpit - a new print from sci-fi illustrator Guy Warley - available in LP (320mm) or Single (200mm) sizes.
• Rob's got a brand new Patreon — Rob's developing his Weird-Field World of spaceships and alien technology over at Patreon.

We look at recent news items that follow this trend; such as re-edits of 42-year-old children's films, speculative architectural visualisations, and self-digitising notebooks. "Why, why, why, why, why?", asks one of our hosts.

But without making things that seemingly have no worth, would we end up with beauties like x6udpngx?

Links:

• Patagonia’s CEO is donating company’s entire $10M Trump tax cut to fight climate change. — Patagonia, one of the good ones.
• Star Wars SC 38 Reimagined - YouTube — Rob loves this. Jon hates it.
• Miysis Studio envisions Notre-Dame with a rebuilt spire and glass roof — Lovely idea for the reconstruction of the roof of Notre Dame Cathedral.
• Beyond The Wild Rumpus: A Guide To Maurice Sendak Books- Book Riot — We didn't get to this on the show, but here's a great guide to the books of Maurice Sendak.
• Watch By the Wey online - BFI Player — Jon lost himself in vintage films from the BFI.
• Fire in the East (Warrior of Rome, #1) by Harry Sidebottom — Jon's been reading this.
• Passionate Journey - Wikipedia — The lovely Richard Weston sent Jon a copy of this wordless novel.
• Provenance by Ann Leckie — Rob's reading this.
• The Wrong Ways: A—E (Ace Jet 170) — Jon, under his Ellipress umbrella, has been working with Acejet170 (Richard Weston) on some marvellous cartographical prints. Coming soon!
• 'Peanuts in Space' Short Coming to Apple TV App in May - MacRumors — Apple and the illiberal arts.
• Australian $50 note typo: spelling mistake printed 46 million times - Australia news - The Guardian — If you've ever made a print cock-up, take solace from the fact it wasn't to the value of nearly one billion Australian dollars.
• Michael Wolf obituary - Art and design - The Guardian — Michael Wolf, creator of those extraordinary photographs of the high-rises of Hong Kong, has died.
• Moleskine’s new smart notebook vectorizes lines in Adobe Illustrator in real time - The Verge — Jon and Rob both deride Moleskine's latest flirtation with digital illustration.
• Animal Photo Art References Search — Need photo reference of a wolf looking at a very specific angle? This is the site for you. Very clever.
• Harviestoun Brewery - Harviestoun Brewery — Jon enjoyed some Old Engine Oil from the Haviestoun Brewery. And we both enjoyed their website and branding. Good work Primate.
• Primate - Digital Agency Edinburgh — Purveyors of design excellence. See previous link.
• CURIOCITY – London Unfolded — Lovely map-based printed goodness from Curiocity.

We're talking taking breaks, blue plaques, iMacs, Kellog's, Capcom and Hellboy, among many other bits and bobs of design-related ephemera.

Give us a whirl. You never know, you might like it.

Also, please leave a review for us in iTunes. We'll love you for ever if you do.

Links:

• ColouriseSG — More machine-learning madness. Upload your black and white photos and have them colourised by Skynet.
• Mike Mignola Almost Wishes He Hadn’t Let Comics’ Hellboy Go — Great interview with Mike Mignola, creator of Hellboy.
• Dave Rapoza's character illustration — One of the very best character illustrations you'll ever see.
• Accenture sued over website redesign so bad it Hertz: Car hire biz demands $32m+ for 'defective' cyber-revamp • The Register — $32million for a website that doesn't work?
• Netflix - Love Death and Robots
• Netflix - Black Summer
• CAPCOM HOME ARCADE — Hit in the face with the (ugly) Joystick
• "Contemporary redesign" for Kellogg’s looks to make brand "recognisable” — Great new branding from Landor for Kellogg's, despite the usual design jargon bullish*t.
• Stop Procrastinating, Boost Productivity & Get Focused on Work - Focusmate® — … we're almost speechless.
• First Blue Plaque for a poster designer — Abram Games, poster artist and designer, gets his due.
• Hoxton Street Monster Supplies — Hoxton Street Monster Supplies is a marvellous fundraising front for the Ministry of Stories. Check out the drop down menu at the top of the page and select a different language.

Links:

• Deep Space Fleet II by This Northern Boy – Ellipress — We launched a new print. Have a peek.
• Metabarons Vol 1 — Rob's recent comic reading
• Pandora's Star — Rob's holiday reading list.
• Low - Rick Remender and Greg Tocchini — Rob is currently loving this.
• Amazon.co.uk: Watch The Expanse - Season 3 - Prime Video — Fantastic hard scifi. Originally on Netflix, now over at Amazon.
• Judas Unchained — Rob's holiday reading list.
• Elysium Fire — Rob's holiday reading list.
• Provenance — Rob's holiday reading list.
• Gateway — Rob's holiday reading list.
• The Girl With all the Gifts — Rob's holiday reading list.
• Beastie Boys Book — Jon's loving this.
• Lullaby — Jon describes this book as "a French book about horrible people with a horrible Nanny who kills their (destined to be) horrible children. Horrible book." So, a recommendation of sorts.
• Fantastic Mr Fox — Jon and Kitty are currently reading this Roald Dahl classic.
• Wind in the Willows — Another classic on Jon's bedside reading list.
• Passionate Journey - Wikipedia — Wordless novels. A precursor to the Graphic Novel.
• Brave New World — Now Jon's stepped on Aldous's grave he's decided to read the book.
• Russian Doll on Netflix — Best sci-fi series in an age.
• Jodorowsky's Dune — Jodorowsky, David Lynch, Denis Villnueve. Dune is the book that keeps on influencing film makers.
• Don McCullin – Exhibition at Tate Britain - Tate — Must see exhibition from one of the world's great photographers.
• In With The Spiders - Zoological Society of London (ZSL) — Lots about spiders in this week's episode.
• Handsome Frank agency talk illustration pricing and licensing – The AOI — Handsome Frank and the AOI (almost) talk about illustration pricing.
• The Martini FAQ — Shaken, or stirred?
• 3dtotal · Learn - Create - Share — 3DTotal's website is stuffed full of useful resources and great tutorials.
• Chicken and ham tangle pie - Recipes - Hairy Bikers — Lovingly crafted by Jon's wife, and eaten - somewhat appreciatively - by Jon.

We take a gander at the new ultra-post-rationalised Netflix ident, a risable Walkers crisp packet redesign, a Linea Sketch review, and Phillip Sulke's superb tanker photography.

Something's in the freezer and it might be alive. Don't worry, it's just Rob's pie.

Links:

• #PicturesMeanBusiness - Pictures help sell books, lets give credit to authors AND illustrators, double the love for every book! — Sarah McIntyre bangs the drum for proper credit for illustrators.
• PHILLIP SULKE — The rather wonderful photography of Phillip Sulke. Check out his drone shots of tankers and ocean liners.
• +d Spin - スピン ビックリマーク コマ — Ridiculous but fun desktop toy from Japan! !
• Go Deeper, Not Wider — Let's all have ourselves a depth year.
• Walkers redesigns its crisp packaging to focus on Britishness — Walkers Crisps go for the gammon market.
• Netflix updates its ident — Netflix and post-rationalisation.
• Linea – Drawing tools for your iPad and iPhone — Great looking drawing app for the iPad Pro.
• Astute Graphics Plugin BundleWas $111 Now $19 - Design Cuts — Astute plugins. Illustrator isn't illustrator without them.
• About - Buttondown — Great looking newsletter service. Dare we put our faith in another business service?
• Mansions of Madness Second Edition — Jon's been playing this recently and it's great!

We also talk Comics / Tabletop Games / Slack Attacks / Elastic Brand Podcast / Dieter Rams / Pies and more…

Links:

• Rams — Gary Hustwit — New documentary from Gary Hustwit, on the legendary product designer Dieter Rams.
• Good design - About Vitsœ - Vitsœ — Dieter Rams' Ten Principles of Good Design.
• Michael Bierut: “Slack knew 95% of people would hate the change” — We weren't that impressed with Slack's redesign, nor were many others.
• Dimensions.Guide- Database of Dimensioned Drawings — Genius.
• Home - Little Heroes Comics — Fantastic charity providing comic making kits for kids in hospital.
• D&AD’s noticeably pencil-free festival identity for 2019 - Creative Review — D&AD festival branding. Nicely done, but why does everything have to be animated these days?
• 3D Printing Records for a Fisher Price Toy Record Player: 4 Steps (with Pictures) — Fantastic idea, provided you have one of the original record players.
• Forgotten Wrecks of the First World War - Interactive Chart — Forgotten wrecks. Time sink.
• World War II Allied Aircraft Crashes — WWII aircraft crash database.

This week in the podcast that is and isn't about human sacrifice, our Agents of Filth are rifling through Uncle Ted's VHS collection. Not that one. Rob and Jon talk about their favourite moments in horror films.

News includes the End of the World, Slasher Art, A Sleep Tracker for Vampires and Boris Johnson's Underpants. Quelle Horreur!

Pies are fresh from Sweeny Todd's… Wait, is that a fingernail. Yum. Wait a minute what's that? It can't be, it can't be. I-i-i-it's a VEGETABLE. Arrrrghhhhh…

Links:

• John Scalzi's The Consuming Fire — Rob and Jon are both reading this sequel to Scalzi's excellent Collapsing Empire.
• The Illustrated World of Mortal Engines — Rob was one of the illustrators for this book which is an illustrated encyclopaedia of the Mortal Engines world created by Philip Reeve.
• Murder Is Her Hobby: Frances Glessner Lee and The Nutshell Studies of Unexplained Death - Smithsonian American Art Museum — Creepy miniatures from the early days of forensic science.
• Edward Burne-Jones review – art that shows how boring beauty can be -Art and design -The Guardian — A withering, and not all that helpful, review of the art of Edward Burne-Jones.
• Jeremy Deller creates a monumental party for Stonehenge centenary -UK news -The Guardian — More wonderful stuff from Jeremy Deller, just a shame about the socks.
• Take that, Charlie Brown! The artists putting the pain into Peanuts -Books -The Guardian — Good Grief, Charlie Brown exhibition at Somerset House.
• I pulled a 1,500-year-old sword out of a lake -Life and style -The Guardian — Saga Vanececk, the new rightful Queen of Everywhere.
• What next for photography in the age of Instagram? -Art and design -The Guardian — The Power of Photography. Forget the clickbait headline, this is a great article about photography in today''s changing landscape of technology and social media.
• Kai Grunwitz on Twitter: "👉 Something completely different: Great #AR experience 😅 Scary experience - but great #AugmentedReality window at a bus stop 👍 cc @FrRonconi @enricomolinari @kashthefuturist @DrUmeshPrabhu @HeinzVHoenen @DrJDrooghaag @evankirstel @KateOflaherty @nigewillson @alvinfoo @psb_dc… https://t.co/EwHsMQfaLc" — Great use of Augmented Reality.
• The Fog - Wikipedia — Rob''s scares!
• The Woman in Black (1989 film) - Wikipedia — Rob''s scares!
• An American Werewolf in London - Wikipedia — Jon and Rob''s scares!
• Jaws (film) - Wikipedia — Rob''s scares!
• The Beast with Five Fingers - Wikipedia — Rob''s scares!
• Zombi 2 - Wikipedia — Rob''s scares! This film was originally released in the UK as Zombie Flesh Eaters.
• Alien (film) - Wikipedia — Jon and Rob''s scares!
• The Burning (film) - Wikipedia — Jon''s Scares.
• The Shining (film) - Wikipedia — Jon''s Scares.
• Poltergeist (1982 film) - Wikipedia — Jon''s Scares.
• The Blair Witch Project - Wikipedia — Jon''s Scares. (But only the last 30 seconds)
• Carrie (1976 film) - Wikipedia — Jon''s Scares.
• The Wicker Man - Wikipedia — Jon and Rob watched this again for Halloween, and both realised that they''d probably never watched it all the way through before.
• The Haunting of Hill House — Jon and Rob watched this for Halloween.
• The Ash Tree by M. R. James. — Halloween reading for Jon and Rob.
• A Podcast to the Curious – The M.R. James Podcast — More M. R. James than you can shake a skeletal stick at.
• (1) Hammer House Of Horror: Season 1 Episode 1- Witching Time (Full Episode) - YouTube — Jon rewatched a bit of Hammer House of Horror. Hilarious and terribly sexist!

Following on from Creative Review's recent flurry of articles on the matter, Rob and Jon ask if design can save retail? Can design save anything at all? They do their best to obfuscate the entire debate.

News includes Apple (briefly, you'll be relieved to hear), a new map of Antarctica, Fontsmith's new catalogue, kitbashed spaceships, octogenarian fashion models, Incompuito buildings and a new New Adventures Conference.

Pies are consumed like the greedy capitalist pigs we are.

Links:

• REMA - New map of the Antarctic.
• Home - New Adventures - 23rd-25th January 2019
• Marcel du Long - Pixels & Plastics — Amazing model making from Jake Jerde and Marcel Du Long.
• Sunnyside Podcast Show — Rob's been enjoying this podcast. A funny chat about comics, art, film, pop culture…
• Fontsmith Library Book – Fontsmith Shop — Mmmmm.
• George Allen – Ellipress — Ellipress has a new artist on board. Check out the work of architecture student George Allen.
• Alexandra Leese (@alexleese) • Instagram photos and videos — Alex Leese's work for Helmut Lang caught our eye.
• Can creativity save the British high street?
• Best Basic Punkt Dumb Mobile Phones without Internet - Modern Non Smartphone technology — A phone for the (wannabe) unconnected. Or just another expensive gimmick?
• Mud Foods — Jon's Pie.
• Robson's Butcher and Deli — Rob's Pie.

We talk to Dan about making comics, his career, industrial poisoning, child labour, and death.

News includes Luna landing, V&A Gaming, Anish Kapoor's massive (dangerous) hole, and jerks on the internet.

Special Guest: Dan Berry.

Links:

• Thingsbydan – Comics, Design & Illustration
• Make It Then Tell Everybody - How artists do what they do — Dan''s excellent podcast.
• Dan Berry (@thingsbydan) - Twitter — Dan on Twitter.
• Justin O’Beirne — Justin O''Beirne''s essays on maps and cartography.
• kottke.org - home of fine hypertext products
• Vent Haven Museum--the World''s Only Museum of Ventriloquism — Vent Haven (hell if you are spooked by dummies).
• ザ壁 (@ka_nai) • Instagram photos and videos — Incredible photography of Japanese architectural gubbins. Pipes, vents, cables, ducts.
• The Long Way to a Small, Angry Planet by Becky Chambers — Jon has been reading…
• The V&A opens up the black box of video game design
• Creative Review by Creative Review on Apple Podcasts
• Man falls into Anish Kapoor''s painted hole installation - Creative Bloq
• Gosh Comics

We're back again,
with a hiatus haiku.
You are most welcome.

The podcast that is, and isn't, but was, on holiday is back. Has the hot summer exposed any hidden secrets in your back garden?

We catch up with news and remind ourselves which end of the microphone to hold.

Rob looks at orange Lego spaceships, papermakers and Studio Ghibli. Jon takes a look at The Design Museum's events arm(s), a comic in the Booker Prize longlist, and a celebration of the BBC Micro. Switching to Mode 0…

Pies are from Aldi and St Margarets. A clear dichotomy of pies, if ever there was one.

Chat meanders across diverse subjects such as grapefruit curses, Baby robins, Extremity comic, Imaginary Worlds podcast, Yoda's house, Mike Sienkiewicz , Brian Eno, the resurgent Microsoft, imposter syndrome, and, of course, pies.

Special Guest: Mark Phoenix.

What time is love? No one knows, now we're all wearing Nuncs. Also with Roger Dean, Atari and Bill Gold, it's like the Seventies never went away.

Now they've gone, it's pie-time! Two of them. Both encased. In case you have forgotten what a pie is.

Links:

• Revisionist History Podcast — Rob's been enjoying Malcolm Gladwell's fascinating podcast.
• Worlds by Raphael Lacoste — Worlds - The concept art of Raphael Lacoste.
• The Etherington Brothers — The Etherington Brothers. Comic creators, illustrators, concept artists, the list goes on.
• Anthony Burrill — Jon has a new Anthony Burrill print. We're both big fans of A.B.
• Hellboy Omnibus Volume 1: Seed of Destruction: Amazon.co.uk: Mike Mignola, John Byrne: 9781506706665: Books — Jon's been reading this to his four year old daughter, for which we salute him.
• Spotify — Jon's been listening to this. Rob has never heard any of their music.
• Roger Dean On The Future - YouTube — Roger Dean discusses the future.
• Nunc-Home — Nunc. I can't bring myself to write anything else about it.
• Results forbill gold - Posteritati Movie Poster Gallery - New York — Help yourself to some of the finest film posters ever produced, if you have a few hundred quid. RIP Bill Gold.
• A gothic space rocket to a secret realm – Westminster Abbey's new £23m tower - Art and design - The Guardian — Jon and Rob both agree the new Weston Tower at Westminster Abbey looks fantastic. Get the to the Triforium.
• Notes to Myself – Produced For Use — Creative inspiration in stationery form from Brendan Dawes.
• New Adventures — New Adventures in Web Design is back next year.
• Atari VCS: Game, Stream, Connect Like Never Before - Indiegogo — Would you spend £300 to play Pong? We're not so sure.
• Dann 🚐 on Twitter: "How much time does it take to learn design enough to land a job you think?" — Dann Petty started a conversation on Twitter about how long it takes to learn Web Design.
• Taking Chelsea flower show inspiration from a refugee camp in Iraq - Life and style - The Guardian — The wonderful Lemon Tree Trust garden at the Chelsea Flower show. Celebrating the resilience and creativity of refugees through the gardens of the Domiz Camp in Iraq.
• Designing Northern Ireland’s new vertical bank notes — We didn't have time to talk about Northern Ireland's new vertical banknotes, but they are ace so have a look.
• Models - 3D Resources — Our website of the week is this, frankly jaw-dropping, repository of 3D models of Nasa stuff. From the Hubble Telescope to the Apollo Lunar Lander, Comets to Asteroids. Incredible. And free to download.

News includes an Oliver Postgate exhibition, in-game art in Codemasters' Onrush, Microsoft's adaptive controller for disabled gamers, Monde's bookend models, and the curious case of the European Museum of the year.

We talk to Ben about his career in illustration, his creative process, his plans for the future, and why social media should be a two-way conversation.

Pies are a Pieminister Kate and Sidney pie (Jon – 7), a Minced Beef pie from Turner's Pies in Chichester (Rob – 8.96), and a John Thorner's Steak and London Pride pie (Ben – 8).

Special Guest: Ben the Illustrator.

Links:

• Temperate House - Kew — Rob visited the newly restored Temperate House at Kew Gardens. It's now his favourite building in London.
• The Fall - Vol.1 & pre-order issues 4-6! Blackyard Shop Illustration GmbH — Rob's been reading The Fall, by Jared Muralt.
• The Complete Calvin and Hobbes: Amazon.co.uk: Bill Watterson: 0050837310001: Books — Jon's been reading Calvin and Hobbes to Kitty.
• Mr Bingo’s Online Supermarket — Jon received a, typically filthy, book from Mr Bingo.
• Paper Girls Volume 1: Amazon.co.uk: Brian K. Vaughan, Cliff Chiang: 9781632156747: Books — Ben has been reading Volume 4 of Paper Girls, a comic book he recommends.
• Calf high socks. Overlook hotel socks. Burgundy, Party Orange and Chocolate Brown socks. — Rob was particularly taken by these Kubrickian lower-leg coverings.
• Magical Bookends Transform Bookshelves into the Back Alleys of Japan - Spoon & Tamago — Incredible bookends from @monde. Turning bookshelves in to little corners of Tokyo.
• Clangers, Bagpuss & Co - Hull Culture and Leisure — If you like the Clangers, Bagpuss, or Noggin the Nog, get yourself to this exhibition in Hull.
• Microsoft to launch disability-friendly Xbox controller - Games - The Guardian — An adaptive Xbox controller to make games more accessible.
• 8x10 - Sell Limited Edition Fine Art with a Single Post to Instagram — A new way to sell art through Instagram.
• ONRUSH - The all-action arcade racer from Codemasters — Ben, along with a number of other artists, contributed art for this brilliant looking game.
• Home - Design Museum — The Design Museum has been named European Museum of the Year. Jon and Rob have issues, some of them about this.
• Ben the Illustrator — Ben's brilliant website.
• Ben the Illustrator - Illustrator's Survey — The 2017 Illustrator's Survey.
• Ben The Illustrator (@BenIllustrator) - Twitter — Ben on Twitter.
• Ben The Illustrator (@benillustrator) • Instagram photos and videos — Ben on Instagram.
• Ben The Illustrator Print Store — Buy Ben's gorgeous work here.
• Superorganism - The Debut Album Out Now — Ben's pick for Website of the Week. The fabulous website for Superorganism.

Rob and Jon discuss tools they use everyday to help them do their work more efficiently. Find out who will survive when the grid shuts down.

Jon's pie gets more points than Rob's. The world is in turmoil.

Links:

• Goliath: Amazon.co.uk: Tom Gauld: 9781770462991: Books — Tom Gauld's fabulous Goliath.
• Moebius Library: The World of Edena: Amazon.co.uk: Moebius: 9781506702162: Kitchen & Home — Moebius's wonderful World Of Edena.
• BBC Sound Effects - Research & Education Space — BBC Sound Effects department have put over 16,000 sound effects online.
• Scenes Unseen: The Summer of ’78 - The New York Times — Another beautiful photo essay from the NYT. Summer of 1978.
• Temperate House- Kew — The Temperate House at Kew has reopened after five years and £40 million.
• WhatsApp CEO Jan Koum quits over privacy disagreements with Facebook- Technology- The Guardian — WhatsApp founder quits FB
• Visit- Thought Bubble Festival — Will the next North v South field trip be to the Thought Bubble comic festival in Leeds?
• About - Bullet Journal — We really have no idea…
• The all-new Things. Your to-do list for Mac & iOS — Things app.
• Magnet – Window manager for Mac — Magnet app.
• Home - Dropbox — Dropbox.
• Zeplin — Zeplin app.
• Moleskine Sketchbook: Moleskine: Amazon.co.uk: Office Products — Moleskine sketchbook.
• STABILO point 88 Fineliner, Black, Wallet of 10: Amazon.co.uk: Office Products — Stabilo Point 88 pen.
• Post-it Super Sticky Notes, 3 x 3-Inches, Neon Orange, 5-Pads/Pack: Amazon.co.uk: Office Products — Orange Post-It notes. The only colour that matters.
• MiniSun A3 LED Modern Ultra-Slim Art Craft Design LightPad: Amazon.co.uk: Kitchen & Home — Minisun A3 Lightbox.
• Tim Bushe is fundraising for HFT — Tim Bushe's marvellous fundraising effort as Hedge Trimmer Man.
• Sainsbury's Steak, Mushroom & Red Wine Pie 235g - Sainsbury's — Rob's Pie. Which merited a 6 out of 10.
• Sainsbury's Mini Bramley Apple Topped Pork Pies, Taste the Difference x4 200g - Sainsbury's — Jon's pie, which he awarded a solid seven out of ten.

News includes a new freelance rate calculator, Birmingham Design Festival, Record Store Day, and Rob updates us with Martin Sorrell’s latest movements.

This week’s pies are from Marks and Spencer, Pieminister and Yorkshire Baker. One of the pies is called Kevin.

Special Guest: Daniel Benneworth-Gray.

Links:

• Old Man's War by John Scalzi
• A Boy Made of Blocks by Keith Stuart
• SodaStream UK — Water made exciting (ps shoot the copywriter).
• Day Rate Calculator
• Record Store Day — Ebay scam or worthwhile cause?
• Wetherspoon — Social Media has no value
• Sorrell Gone — Martin Sorrell is no more at WPP. Despite earning £200million over the last five years, he’s accused of misusing company funds.
• All Too Human — National Portrait Gallery exhibition – All Too Human
• Birmingham Design Festival — Birmingham Design Festival looks like a treat.
• Han Solo ice cube tray
• Kona Brewing Co. — Rob's beer this week is a Longboard Island Lager
• Five AM Red Ale from BrewDog — Daniel's beer this week
• Yorkshire Baker pies — Daniel enjoys a Steak and Ale pie. He believes it was already cooked. 8/10.
• Pierate's review of M&S's Steak and Old Peculiar Pie — Rob's pie this week scored a 7.2. If you thought we're weird reviewing pies, then take a look at www.pierate.co.uk.

  Over 600 reviews and counting, and boasting a mind-bendingly complicated scoring system that Rob would be proud of.

• Kevin the pie — Jon bites into a large prune stone. WHICH HAS NO PLACE IN A SAVOURY PIE DAGNAMMIT!

  Dolmio in a bap. 2/10

What's happened in our absence? Not a whole lot. Creative Review has gone to the paywall, Charlie Higson got stuck in a twisty maze of passageways, all alike, Fonts got all, like, look at us, we're fonts, we're so academic. And Hellboy is coming to a tabletop near you.

This week we talk digital tipping jars: Patreon, Kofi and the like. Rob's considering throwing his flat cap onto the cobbles and asking for donations. Jon works his monocle into his mean little eye and turns his snooty nose skywards.

Pies are tested as usual, but no LOTR this week. Old Man Willow stole our books.

Links:

• Deller Pick Up — RRUNews
• Mantic Games to launch Hellboy Board Game
• Ko-fi.com
• Patreon
• Route Map — Quintin Lake’s walk around the coast of Britain
• FontFace Dojo
• Fighting Fantasy return
• Font Map · An AI Experiment by IDEO
• Google Art & Culture Experiment - Art Palette
• The Devil You Know: A Felix Castor Novel — Mike Carey's series of London-based Urban Fantasy novels

News includes Wacom’s artist profile films, how Michael Bierut chooses typefaces, t shirts as design, academicism, The Culture, Dr Who’s rebrand, and Oxford Commas (see what I did there).

One pie is disqualified for being a stew with a lid. LOTR Chapter 5: A Conspiracy Unmasked is discussed in the extra bits.

Links:

• Storm Front: The Dresden Files, Book One (The Dresden Files series 1) eBook: Jim Butcher: Amazon.co.uk: Books
• Chalk by Paul Cornell
• Frank Quitely sketch book — Frank Quitely: Drawings & Sketches - a new book featuring work from the sketchbooks of comic artist Frank Quitely (Vincent Deighan).
• BBC Four - Detectorists
• Brand New: New Logo for Doctor Who by LittleHawk — Who?
• Jean-Léon Gérôme — Academicism
• Social Media Marketing Statistics 2018
• Griefcast on acast — Comedians talking about death
• How Pentagram’s Michael Bierut Picks A Typeface
• Umbrella studios

NB – This episode was recorded in an insanely busy British Museum by a decidedly amateur sound recordist. You have been warned!

Also, the podcast now has chapters so you can skip to the bits you want to hear, rather than listen to us waffle. Oh wait, we waffle all the way through every show. Scratch that.

Links:

• British Museum - Welcome to the British Museum

News takes the form of a wingéd serpent and spews forth its foul breath of portent – in which you'll find an all-female line up for 2000AD, why a low value of art equals theft, and an Anthony Burrill book from new imprint Volume.

LOTR: Chapter 3 – Three is company

Links:

• The Owl Service by Alan Garner
• 2000 AD Publishing First All-Female Sci-Fi Special
• Falcon Heavy rocket launches
• The Follower Factory - The New York Times
• Brendan Dawes - On Valuing Artists
• Look & See — Volume
• India Street Lettering

In a news special our hosts talk: Secret army bases, SLR camera revival, Tolkein-esque maps, jars of Nutella, and sage advice for design graduates.

Jon’s pie this week is disqualified for being a thinly-veiled quiche and Rob picks a repeat winner.

LOTR: Chapter 2 – Shadow of the Past.

Links:

• Fitness tracking app Strava gives away location of secret US army bases - Technology - The Guardian
• Black Hammer Volume 1 by Jeff Lemire, Dean Ormston
• Algorithm designs seven million different jars of Nutella
• Noma Bar interview
• Middle Earth''s Maps
• The Hanging Tree by Ben Aaronovitch
• The perils of trademarking logos
• Emotional support peacock
• Now You See It and Other Essays on Design by Michael Beirut
• Reflex: Bringing back the analogue SLR camera by REFLEX — Kickstarter
• The Big Midweek: Life Inside The Fall by Steve Hanley
• PENTATONIC HUSKY PHONE CASE
• Asmodee Editions Timeline British History Card Game

In the Palantír this week: Ben the Illustrator’s illustrator survey, the last pencil factory, Nintendo’s Switch to cardboard, and backward-facing books.

The Guardian has had a redesign. North V South takes a look at what’s changed.

Pies this week are from Pieminister and Marks and Spencer. Then it’s onto the first chapter of The Lord of the Rings: An unexpected party.

Three rings for the Clients who call on Skype,
Seven for the Type-Lords who love to moan,
Nine for Bearded Hipsters doomed to try (hard),
One for the Creative Director on their Aeron throne
In the Studio with their headphones on.
One podcast to rule them all, One podcast to find them,
One podcast to bring them all and in the darkness bore them
In the Studio with their headphones on.

News this week include faulty chips, and design news that doesn’t really tell you anything other than there’s not a lot of news about design.

Was 2017 a bad year? Will 2018 be a good year? You decide! The chaps talk goals and resolutions. Join them as they tick of the failures.

Also the hosts announce their most ambitious feature yet; Read a book one chapter at a time and then talk about it. Shut the door!

Pies are Christmas and Moroccan-related.

News includes a really stupid camera, a new book on Games Workshop, a new logo for F1, and some really useless tips from "Design Leaders" on how to get a pay rise.

The chaps talk about their favourite books, films and designs of the year. Then they eat pie. Hold onto your hats: Jon scores more than a 5.

We answer your questions while drinking strong beer. It's what we do best.

Oh, and review pies, of course.

News sees us step closer to the world of Blade Runner with an image enhancer algorithm, and a step further away with an self driving bus crash. And as a general reminder that humans have been idiots since they left the trees, we look at Medieval Deathbot and Snapchat’s $30 million dollar silly glasses writedown.

Pies are stewed beef for Jon, and a bog standard pork pie for Rob.

Once that load of old nonsense is out of the way our intrepid reporters bring you a fresh heap of more design-related nonsense: Facets, printers, telegram love, Hero Forge and space history are all up for discussion.

Then settle down and pull the tartan rug over your knees as Grandpa Rob explains social media to Granddad Jon.

Grandpa Rob forgot his teeth so no pie for him. Grandad Jon gums his way through a bizarrely-named Zanzibar bean and coconut pie.

Stupid cameras, memorable high street logos, a swimming pool filled with gold. All the news, none of it very useful. So all the better for it.

The chaps went on a rare NVS Field Trip to see the new Blade Runner sequel. They talk about the film’s legacy and sources of inspiration, the central themes of the film, and how hot Ryan Gosling is.

Pies this week feature a chicken and ham made by the Royals, and a beef and chilli made by committee. The manufacturer recommends serving the latter with a salsa. We say up no, no, no. No, no, no, no, no.

In news, Dropbox gets all nu-rave, Sonos journeys into the Amazon, Timothy Toothbrush says hi, and UKIP’s rebrand gets them into hot water. Hopefully.

Rob teaches Jon about using Instagram as a promotional tool rather than a social media anxiety generator.

A cold pie this week for Jon gets a uncharacteristically high score. Rob’s is chicken and ham heaven. Quite literally, if you’re a pig or a chicken*.

And you believe in a deity*.

*Pies are not diety.

This week sees a return of the book review, with a thumb through Mike Monteiro’s “You’re my favorite client”: A book for clients about the design process. The chaps also stumble through what they did in the day in a futile attempt to make it sound like they have meaningful lives.

Once they’ve failed that, it’s onto pies. Jon reviews something that is quite plainly a quiche. Rob keeps it real with a steak and ale pie.

This week locks digital and analogue in a fight to the death. Our hosts chat about why we love some superseded technologies and why patina is so important to humans. talk turns to what constitutes being alive, and ends on the irrefutable fact that everything changes. Humans just don’t like it.

After that Rob and Jon decant their brains back into their craniums and try some pies. Everything might change, but our show always ends in pies.

This week our hosts talk kitbashing, expanding clothing, Winnie the Pooh, print errata and Sonic the Hedgehog.

Rob and Jon return to Dunkirk to talk about frames and containers. We look at the origins of the 4:3 format, 35mm film and ask why widescreen is a thing. Many questions remain unanswered but a damn good time is had trying to answer them.

Charlie Bigham returns to generously share his Chicken and Mushroom pie with Jon. Rob tries to contact alien life with his frozen Steak and Ale pie from Sainso’s.

This week our intrepid explorers of design discover the meaning of the phrases Kensington Gore and Etaoin Shrdlu, as well as looking at a £650 box of Lego, Erik Spiekermann's storm in a tweet cup, BBC Sport's new typeface and Pantone's oh-so generous donation to the Purple One's Estate*.

Our first great pie disaster means that Jon is literally scraping the floor for his pie this week.

• This week only, we're giving away RGB 230,33,53 for FREE. Use it wherever you like.

Rob and Jon have been to the cinema to see Christopher Nolan’s latest film, Dunkirk. They’ve got quite a lot to say about their experiences. Some of it is lucid. Listen on to find out what Dunkirk, Jan Hammer and giant thrips have (or don’t have) in common.

Rob just about gets away with a pie review this week*. He scoffed a shepherd’s pie for lunch at the Ivy in Richmond. Jon pops a couple of Tesco Melton Mowbrays in his piehole.

• Written warning in the post.

+++ START MESSAGE +++

It’s been holiday season for the southern half of the podcast that is, and isn’t, about design. Despite this, server crashes and recording gear not working, here’s the latest episode for your aural relish.

This week, bereft of anything interesting to talk about, the gents talk about some websites of note. Well, Rob does anyway.

This week’s pies are layered chicken and ham layered slice from Sainsbury’s and a chicken, ham hock, and leek pie from Armstrong’s in St Margarets.

+++ END-OF-MESSAGE +++

Milton Glaser’s Ten Things I Have Learned is a collection of observations, philosophies and soundbites that the great designer has been hawking about for at least 18 years. We sprinkle this design gold dust onto our resident cavemen and see what happens.

You’ll be cock-a-hoop to know that this week’s pies are fully encased. The fact that the filling resembles cat food is not so promising.

Rob and Jon then talk about the influence and power of books. They ask each other about the reasons why they read, and discuss a few books that really made a difference in their lives.

Both pies this week are very probably not pies. Beers are from the Adnams and Redemption breweries.

This week Jon and Rob talk about their favourite film posters; from Star Wars to Kill Bill, You Only Live Twice to the Exorcist.

Pies today are brought to you from Marks and Spencer, chickens and leeks.

The chaps return to talking about education and the best way forward for people looking to further their design education. The martinis don't help them make their minds up. Or much sense.

This episode is bookended with recipes from dead celebrities. Jon wings it with one of Linda McCartney's Vegetarian Country pies. Like her singing, it's not very good.

We look forward to newly launched magazines: Pressing Matters and Typenotes. Rob wonders if Ryan Gosling’s new Blade Runner will deliver the Golden Goose’s egg or perhaps a pickled egg? Judge Dredd is coming to TV. Will they get Mega City One right?

NVS met up earlier this week and saw Paula Scher deliver a fascinating talk at the Royal Geographical Society in Knightsbridge. She was promoting a new book on her life’s work by Unit Editions called Paula Scher: Works. Hear the chaps discuss what they made of it.

Rob scoffs a Higgidy Chicken, bacon and mushroom pie while Jon chomps his way through a delicious rabbit and bacon pie. He is not happy with the new label for Timothy Taylor’s Landlord.

• TTD † Jon later enjoys a rabbit and bacon pie. These events are not connected.

News this week includes a farewell to the creator of the Bash Street Kids, a map identification schematic and a grouchy gripe about digital content ownership. Ordanance Survey we’re looking at you. From behind the tumulus.

Our hosts then talk about process versus creativity. Can one exists without the other? Can either be taught? Why is Jon talking about medieval misericords? Listen on to find out more…

Both pies are from Sainsbury’s Taste the Difference range. Jon’s Chicken and Ham doesn’t taste any different to chicken soup. Rob’s Chicken and Porcini could do with a grind of the old mill. He’s never far from heavy industry that lad.

This week’s special edition looks at the A-Z of typography. Our two presenters are hardly the font of all type knowledge but they’ve been bold and taken a pica into the wonderful world of type.

It's 11am. Rob eats a truffled pie washed down with a beer. Jon has a freshly baked custard tart and a cup of coffee. He’s not an animal.

This week North V South looks at self doubt. Self doubt can be crippling but it also drives some designers and artists to produce great work. How can you find a healthy balance in your working life? Is it possible? Do you need to be a superstar or work for the biggest brands to get satisfaction in your work? Who knows. What we do know is that there will always be pies. Listen on, dear listener…

This week the guardians of the drifting space hulk HMS NVS listen in to faded radio waves from the motherworld about a man correcting grammar on the streets of Bristol, photographs of stranded ships and Jean-Michel Jarre's French Bulldog-shaped speakers.

Rob and Jon then have a gander at their three favourite pieces of graphic design. Jon, as usual, questions the question and slides further into self doubt and paranoia. Rob drinks a couple of excellent German beers.

Pies are of the pork variety. Oh, and would you like to buy some magic dusters?

Our good gentle hosts prattle on about what they’ve been up to over the last five weeks. They then furkle through tidbits of news they’ve kept at the back of the fridge.

It’s a good week for pies. Jon would like to adjust his score from a six to a seven. To find out more you’ll have to listen to the podcast.

Rob and Jon look into the continuation of the 2016 pigment wars, Google’s Blade Runner-ish image technology, McLaren’s Trump-coloured car and Ian Livingston’s return to writing Fighting Fantasy books. Jon uses the phrases “anal fistula” and “shout out”. For this, North V South apologises.

Pies are quite good this week.

See you in a few weeks!

This week North V South looks at design for good. The chaps polish their halos and dive right in. The boys look at the semantics of doing good and explore what they can do, as small businesses, that will help people. They get all ranty about the Battersea Power Station redevelopment along the way.

This week’s pies are Sainsbury's Taste the Difference Steak and London Porter shortcrust and M&S Steak and Old Peculiar Ale.

The duo sit, wrapped in their Space Wolf furs, droning on about drones, Barnbrook, IKEA’s latest award, Lego Life and Peta’s recent bonkers broadside at the futuristic world of Warhammer 40,000.

Rob and Jon abandon their monochromatic homelands and go on a quest for a fabled colour utopia. Along the way they talk about colour perception, colour management, colour archives and why choosing colour is so damned hard.

Listen on to find out if canned pies can indeed taste nice, and why the term gluten free should never be applied to pies.

The chaps catch up post-Christmas and look forward to what's in store for each of them in 2017. In amongst that is some news about Wacom's new sketchy gadget, tech trends, the new Star Wars film (SPOILER ALERT!) and The KLF.

Chicken pies are served. Only one of them may possibly have been made by Her Majesty. The other one died in vain.

Pies in space: No, not one of Rob’s less grubby fantasies, but a reality thanks to the Wigan World Pie Eating Championships. Who said British endeavour was dead? Other news includes a new skyscraper for London, 2000AD coming to a tabletop near you and a rather expensive bottle of whisky that comes embedded in a tree.

The boys look back over a tumultuous year that tipped the world off course a bit. After a rant from Jon, they decide that they’d like, a, the media to shut up a bit and, b, people to start speaking truthfully. Once that’s cleared up the world should return to its normal axis.

The last week of mince pies pits Aldi’s finest against M&S’s ultimate mince warrior.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all our listeners. Thanks for enduring our wittering in 2016. See you on the other side…

There’s not much time for news this week but the boys look at the end of the Pick Me Up show, Jessica Hische’s automated response generator and the BBC program about the graphic designer with Parkinson’s. Is it dusty in here? There’s something in my eye.

Christmas presents: What’s on the wish-list, what not to buy and what the chaps think are great gifts for your loved ones (that deep down you secretly covet for yourself.)

Pies this week came from Betty’s in Yorkshire, courtesy of the very lovely Hannah Wilson. North V South records the world’s (possibly) very first Mince Pie Consumption Simulcast™.

As Pebble plummets into the ocean of redundant tech we wonder if smartwatches are actually not that smart. Jon’s hair is ruffled by Google’s wind-powered server farms, while Rob’s syrup stays in place with a dab of Bostonian molasses.

This week the gents ponder over the pearls of wisdom they would cast upon their younger selves. If only they would just listen…

Pies are mincey. It’s nearly Christmas after all.

News this week includes stuff about Manhattan, Grayson Perry, Wetransfer, The Smiths and Mr Bill Drummond.

The chaps talk about scheduling work, worrying about the cliff and what they do to try to bring order to their work.

It’s December and so begins our intrepid explorers’ hunt for the UK’s best mince pie. Rob’s off to a strong start and Jon had to nip to Co-op because he’d forgotten it was December.

In episode 38, news this week includes a look at the Frankenstein’s monster of Apple’s new festive ad. Rob asks whether the new Hockney windows at Westminster Abbey are going to look out of place? And Jon asks if VR is going to change the art world? (Answer: no.)

Today we climb on board the USS Palomino and journey into cultural black holes. There’s a difference in approach between the known unknowns Rob) and the unknown unknowns (Jon). Rob fares better as Jon couldn’t figure out what the unknown unknowns were because he didn’t know.

Pies are then reviewed.

Jon ties together news items about IKEA, Noam Chomsky, Speedball 2 and a corrugated ruler. Rob can only gaze upon proceedings in awe while wearing a folding bike helmet that looks like a Christmas decoration.

An M&S roast chicken pie and a huge beef pie are today’s special guests.

News this week looks at Toblerone’s gap in the market, Kingsmill bread and a Lego Yellow Submarine complete with Fab Four Minifigs.

The chaps then talk about their pet hates. Get ready for a moanfest.

Ding dong. Rob gets all Christmassy this week with his pie. It is November after all.

This week the all-seeing eyeball roams over Hogarth’s Gin Lane reimagined, Somerset House’s fillip for artists, Vine’s demise and, finally, rants over a rash of pretentious Kickstarter campaigns. Frenzied!

Rob explores the ins and outs of selling your own work as an illustrator. He uses words like monetise. Shocking!

Pies this week include a vegetarian pie from a butchers. Horror!

Yo! News this week includes a Japanese-themed rebrand for the UK-based sushi chain. A truck with video screens built in to reduce road deaths. And a snappy new logo for Kodak predictably plucked from the archives. But what packaging!

This week’s pie was sent to us by Mike Sullivan, top designer and top chef too, it turns out. The venison, skirt, onion and mushroom pie scores a whopping 19 out of 20. Sensational. He’d even put fancy lattice bits on the top.

News this week looks at the proliferation of a side of lifestyle images with everything. Easy on the Dachshund, Luigi. Rob looks into eerie images of apartments in New York’s libraries while waiting for his wireless kettle to boil.

Grids are the main topic this week. We ask “what is a grid?”. It's hardly All the President’s Men is it? Jon gets confused as per usual. Rob gets riled about post-rationalised grids.

Pies fare a bit better this week apart from some copywriting issues.

Our dialectically-opposed hosts then pick three of their favourite paintings and talk about them. Which is ideal for an audio-only podcast. Isn’t it?

Jon reviews another frozen second-hand pie. It wasn’t frozen like ice cream. He had defrosted it first. He’s not an animal.

This week the Gents talk about dream houses. Where would you live and what would you live in? Moats, Mulberry trees, billiard rooms, gold banisters and mountain top observatories are just some of the ideas bandied about.

Pies arrive and pass without much of a fuss, as they continue to dream…

*At time of last survey.

The book of the month is Bill Drummond's 45, a memoir of his life at that point in time and a truly great book about art, music and the perception of truth. NVS thoroughly enjoyed it and urge you to read it.

Rob returns to a fertile pie source while Jon ferrets around in the freezer for yet another disappointment. Beer is also drunk.

With a fair bit of news to catch up on, the chaps inevitably talk about Apple’s new offerings, as well as the Tank’s 100th birthday and an alarm clock that wakes with a whiff.

Rob and Jon end up in a Mayfair pub eating pies and drinking beer, while the rest of London melts in an unseasonal heatwave. Such is our commitment to the noble pie, dear listener.

350 years ago the Great Fire of London broke out in a baker’s shop in Pudding Lane. We discuss this monumental event (see what I did there) and talk about lost buildings we would love to have visited.

This week Rob’s posh pork pie from Selfridges knocks Jon's humble mince beef pie out of the park with an 8 out of 10.

Following on from our chat about secret places from last week, we talk about maps. We get completely lost discussing their origins.

This week sees an all time low in pies. We’d have been better off with a nice salad.

*Allegedly

The chaps catch up with the latest design news freshly scraped from the bottom of a barrel. It is August after all.

Secret places are on the menu du jour today. But you’ll have to listen to find out more.

Pies of dubious credentials are partaken of, and rather enjoyed, by our two young heroes.

We talk about the illustrators and tools that have inspired us; from childhood, right up to the present day.

And if you get through that lot, we then talk pies. Pies, generously sent through the post by Rob’s lovely mother, all the way from Yorkshire.

We chat about Airbnb’s new design studio, Brighton’s new eye(sore), Rob talks wistfully about his old tutor while Jon tries out Adobe’s Portfolio.

Our book of the month is In Praise of Shadows by Junichiro Tanizaki. We discuss the book deep in bosky contemplation, while perched upon Japanese toilets.

The serenity is rudely broken by the arrival of Jon’s stonking pea and ham pie and Rob’s bum-tingling chilli pork pie, kindly donated by one of our listeners.

So we prattle on about Roald Dahl, camera lenses, work spaces, tennis balls and Argentinian bookshops.

After the recent “recycled” coffee cup revelations, our main topic this week was waste. Does capitalism give value to anything other than pure profit? We talk about our own impact on the environment and what we can do to make less of an impact on resources. It’s a subject to which we will return.

We then eat pies. Rob’s has got pork scratchings sprinkled on top, which is just naughty. Jon’s is so hot it could solve the energy crisis.

We catch up with the latest design news: Jon finds out that Elon Musk is not a BodyShop fragrance. We also look at another rebrand using nostalgia as a weapon of mass distraction.

Jon talks about Frank, his WW1-based daily diary project from 2014, and how the tight deadlines made the writing process both a challenge and a pleasure.

Rob scoffs a Royal pie. Jon is pleasantly surprised by Aldi.

We talk about the triumph of Jeremy Deller’s latest art project, the London Museum of Brands and Lego’s latest nostalgic model of a VW Beetle.

Nostalgia is our topic of the week. Other chocolate-based confectionaries are available. Do they still make Topics**?

Watchmen is our book of the month. We enjoy it as much as you can enjoy a comic that’s about self loathing crime fighters. Pies are then scoffed as they should be.

• It didn’t.

** They do.

Rob takes a look at his lifelong fascination with all things space-related. We hear about the latest happenings in space exploration and Rob goes on to talk about the influences in his life as a sci-fi illustrator.

Jon talks about space mice, aliens and nuclear devastation. Again.

Pies this week are homemade. Well, Jon’s is anyway. Rob’s is made in a cold industrial complex deep underground manned only by robots. Or Surrey. They're much the same place.

We catch up with the latest design news in a world where, for now, it seems the dishonest, ill-informed and downright unpleasant are king.

On the eve of what’s turned out to be the biggest break-up of our lives, we discuss what happens when things go horribly wrong with your clients.

Pies are eaten.

As our nation teeters on the edge of being European, we turn our attention to notebooks: the debate consuming the nation.

Jon’s pie this week is a surprise early Fathers’ Day gift. Rob sets fire to his mouth with a hot one.

Rob grapples with a pie that is defined, but ultimately ruined by, a slice of Chorizo while Jon sings from the terraces with a basic steak pie from Tesco.

We jump into a design time machine and take a look at new logos from British Steel and Co-op, as well as rooms frozen in time (or not). The boys then jump back to 175,000 years to a meeting with Neanderthal architects. A lack of decent coffee forces their swift return.

It’s a birthday in some form or another for both our businesses, and so we look forward to what the future brings. Indigestion if Jon’s pies are anything to go by.

Jon’s pork pie gets a lot of love. Consumed by pie envy, Rob embarks on a desperate quest across several counties for a rival. He fails.

Our book of the month is "Insanely Great" by Steven Levy. We explore the origins of the tool that pays our mortgages, hitch a ride back to 1995 and the story of the birth of the Macintosh.

The pies this week turn out to be boils on the behind of Beelzebub himself. But we still eat them anyway.

This week we look at a sinister machine that turns itself off, Jon goes a bit cuckoo and tries to explain post digital, while Rob coos at mating pigeons and miniature houses.

We discuss whether you make your own luck by just working hard or if the hands of the gods are upon us like that film with the mechanical owl in it.

We then present a synchronised pie review for the first time.

Jon gets all hot under the collar about fake marketing campaigns and flimsy pseudo lifestyle businesses. Perhaps he picked up a virus from the hand dryer? Our tenacious duo then tackle and try to solve the free pitch dilemma. Did they do it? Did they heck.

Pies are then partaken of and farewells made.

Our rambling discourse takes a stroll through Victorian space exploration, vastly overpaid executives and the origins of the word Bovril.

We talk about music in office culture and the various stereotypes one might meet when working in a studio. Then Jon drops the Potty bomb. Listen on, reader-listeners. With your eye-ears.

The chaps talk about The Guardian’s experimental design layouts, Erik Spiekermann’s print shop, British Steel logo redux, a grundie exhibition at the V&A and the new, very silly, Kindle.

They chat about the recent 2000AD documentary on Channel 4, and remember how much they used to love the Galaxy's greatest comic.

They then eat pies. Such is their commitment to pie reviewing that they do this in the morning like proper weirdos.

We talk about the ephemeral nature of the internet of things, one pound coins, HP's new old logo, personal projects and, of course, pies.

We then ruminate over cheap design services and why designers get their knickers in such a twist over them. That discussion leads us neatly on to the book of the month, Design is a Job by Mike Monteiro, which basically tell us to be professional, pull our trousers up and stop blaming the client.

We then review one authentic pie and a quiche that is masquerading as a pie. The hunt for a vegetable-based pie continues…

We talk about news that revolves around artificial intelligence, 360° videos and Bagpuss. But possibly not all at the same time.

Our intrepid duo then talk about design convergence, and whether that's a good thing. Answer: It probably isn't.

Both Rob(democratically)and Jon(autocratically) ended up with pickle-infused pies. And we can honestly say that this is not a good thing either.

The chaps discuss the pros and cons of design awards. Listen to find out whether con is the pejorative.

Rob's pie this week has its own helipad. Jon has two pies. They fail to mention the fact that it's National Pie Week, mainly because there's no such thing as National Pie Week.

Rob talks about a daily newspaper launch in the UK. Jon reveals his ignorance of world news.

Jon wonders about what will happen to our digital stuff. He discusses whether anything we create online has any value and whether archaeologists in the future will think people from our time are vacuous consumers of emptiness. Rob eats a pie.

We talk about the brouhaha around a couple of recent rebrands. We sad face Facebook's new response icons.

We chat about our book of the month, The City and the City by China Mieville. Rob navigates the conversation around why he didn't do a drawing for the show, while Jon says the words "erm" and "brouhaha" an alarming number of times. Pies are then eaten and judged as they should be.

In this episode Rob tries to teach Jon about new scientific discoveries and almost succeeds. Jon blethers on about how he deals with procrastination. The chaps then masticate as quietly as they can and compare pies.

In this episode Rob questions Jon about his dubious qualifications as a designer and how he got to what he does today. Jon then drivels on inexorably until Rob breaks off the interview to eat a ham hock and pea pie, while Jon continues his trawl through the lower echelons of pies.

In this episode Rob tells Jon how he got into design and how he kicked off his illustration career. Jon then makes Rob jealous by talking about his new iPad Pro and Apple Pencil. Then he eats a pork pie and drinks some beer just to rub it in.